[Mrboots2u]

The BE can be sensitive to tamp pressure, I find. He said he can't tamp much harder. That'll prevent flow (which is some of his problem with getting a short shot out, as it'll cause resistance to the water coming out which will drive the pressure up which will make things even worse).

Sorry mis read, then drop the dose.

No machine is that variable to tamp pressure tbh , having done a slew of shots at no tamp, 5lbs 10lbs etc it doesnt drive contact time as much as you think , its more how you level it that does.

 

[24774]

There's no "standard" there's just what people do, what they can do with the gear they have, what is realistic. nor the quality.If the shots are too weak, go shorter on ratio.

If you are using the pre-programming, you might not have the luxury of being being so picky about ratio.

If 18:55g tastes not bad, it must be fairly "proper" Drink a few more, see if you can work out anything that you think is a fault? Don't assume over-extraction...it might be, but it's a certain kind of bitterness, not all bitterness. To get the extraction down you grind coarser, or pull less shot in the cup. If your shot is quick, it might not be over, if you don't like the look of the shot, focus on the scales, not the thing you don't like the look of ?

1kg to dial in would be a sad waste, you said your coffee is "not bad", maybe stay there a bit, enjoying the coffee you make, move on if there's something you need to fix.

'If you're just starting, I'd aim a bit weaker, so flavours/faults are easier to taste. Ratio (1:2, 1:3, 1:4) sets the strength, not the taste.' - That's interesting, I hadn't thought about it like that.

'1kg to dial in' - I'm hoping it won't take the whole bag! It's just with small bags I don't experiment, if it's OK I leave it as I feel like I'm wasting it if I change things too much. But I won't improve that way. A 1kg bag of the same stuff makes me feel like a few 'wasted' coffees (which are never actually wasted, I drink them all), is OK.

 

[Joe shorrock]

The BE can be sensitive to tamp pressure, I find. He said he can't tamp much harder. That'll prevent flow (which is some of his problem with getting a short shot out, as it'll cause resistance to the water coming out which will drive the pressure up which will make things even worse).

Hi Mac, bit off topic and random, you got a BE and a niche?

 

[-Mac]

Yep

 

[El_Mussi]

Hi - Having a similar problem with a new BE. I'm also new - so figuring that i'm doing something wrong

Was trying to dial in today. Week old beans weighed 18g. Cannot get more than 12 seconds to get to a 36g yield out the otherend. (12 seconds from after pre-infusion i.e. when coffee starts to pour - is this wrong?)

I've ground as fine as the machine will go.

The strange thing is that changing the grind had very little impact on the extraction time at all.

Any help or hints appreciated

 

[Marcros]

how long from pressing the button to 36 in the cup (ie including pre-infusion)?

how does it taste?

 

[24774]

Hi - Having a similar problem with a new BE. I'm also new - so figuring that i'm doing something wrong

Was trying to dial in today. Week old beans weighed 18g. Cannot get more than 12 seconds to get to a 36g yield out the otherend. (12 seconds from after pre-infusion i.e. when coffee starts to pour - is this wrong?)

I've ground as fine as the machine will go.

The strange thing is that changing the grind had very little impact on the extraction time at all.

Any help or hints appreciated

12 seconds pour + 8 seconds (-ish?) pre-infusion time? You're at 20 seconds, not a million miles away. I'm at 25 seconds and can't get less than 55ml whatever I do! (Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, see early posts on this thread).

Is pressure OK? Where is it?

Things to do - alter weight. See what 18.5g, 19g, 19.5g etc does. Try and make distribution and tamp consistent.

The machine does go finer if you change the top burr setting (that is inside the machine, not the setting on the side). I did that today (it's factory set at 6, I put it down to 3) and got a better result with the coffee I'm using.

 

[El_Mussi]

12 seconds pour + 8 seconds (-ish?) pre-infusion time? You're at 20 seconds, not a million miles away. I'm at 25 seconds and can't get less than 55ml whatever I do! (Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, see early posts on this thread).

Is pressure OK? Where is it?

Things to do - alter weight. See what 18.5g, 19g, 19.5g etc does. Try and make distribution and tamp consistent.

The machine does go finer if you change the top burr setting (that is inside the machine, not the setting on the side). I did that today (it's factory set at 6, I put it down to 3) and got a better result with the coffee I'm using.

Hi thanks for quick response- I've adjusted the top burr to 2 and the side setting all the way down to the finest and still having problems - taste and time. Attempted more weight too but reached the limit of what will fit the basket. (I've used a lot of beans trying to dial it).

Reluctant to adjust the top down to one given that i presume that adjustment is primarily there to allow for play as the machine gets older.

Friend has same machine and has never touched the top burr setting - attached are the pics of mine and his grinds at side setting 7 . I know that there will be a difference with beans (mine are 10 day old union )but considering the huge adjustment mine appears to be way too coarse.

I'm tempted to call Sage and see what they say

 

[24774]

Hi thanks for quick response- I've adjusted the top burr to 2 and the side setting all the way down to the finest and still having problems - taste and time. Attempted more weight too but reached the limit of what will fit the basket. (I've used a lot of beans trying to dial it).

Reluctant to adjust the top down to one given that i presume that adjustment is primarily there to allow for play as the machine gets older.

Friend has same machine and has never touched the top burr setting - attached are the pics of mine and his grinds at side setting 7 . I know that there will be a difference with beans (mine are 10 day old union )but considering the huge adjustment mine appears to be way too coarse.

I'm tempted to call Sage and see what they say

View attachment 38011

View attachment 38012

Union from supermarket? And your friend is using fresh beans? That's a world of difference, maybe someone with more knowledge can tell us if that effects grind size that much.

I'd use fresh beans and compare them to your Union grind before ringing Sage.

 

[El_Mussi]

Hi there - union mail order from them direct and vs fresh yes. I've tried different beans too roasted last week. I'm absolutely stumped as thought that with the very finest setting that the grinder could offer I'd be able to force a time longer than 30s. But the longest I've had is 20. I've filmed myself and method and shared and apparently doing nothing wrong. Even if I was you'd imagine I could clog it right?

 

[MWJB]

Hi there - union mail order from them direct and vs fresh yes. I've tried different beans too roasted last week. I'm absolutely stumped as thought that with the very finest setting that the grinder could offer I'd be able to force a time longer than 30s. But the longest I've had is 20. I've filmed myself and method and shared and apparently doing nothing wrong. Even if I was you'd imagine I could clog it right?

Then your grind is too coarse. The only reason you are not going finer is because you don't want to, for reasons that are not obvious to anyone else but you.

 

[El_Mussi]

Then your grind is too coarse. The only reason you are not going finer is because you don't want to, for reasons that are not obvious to anyone else but you.

I'm almost certain the you're correct and a skim of your blog shows that you're an expert and so you must be used to that feeling. I know very little. You win please don't tell my wife or kids

 

[-Mac]

I'd expect a grind like yours from a BE grinder in the coarsest 3/4 range.

 

[MWJB]

I'm almost certain the you're correct and a skim of your blog shows that you're an expert and so you must be used to that feeling. I know very little. You win please don't tell my wife or kids

It's not about winning/losing, it's about following evidence & logic

We all have to let go of things we think to move forward, if those things physically hold us back.

 

[BunkMuffin]

Then your grind is too coarse. The only reason you are not going finer is because you don't want to, for reasons that are not obvious to anyone else but you.

I couldn't have put it better myself.

I'm glad to see whatever bitterness that used to exist in you due not "winning the day" in this forum since 22/11/19 seems to have eroded and you are now giving people helpful and articulate assistance to their coffee related woes.

Never change my coffee loving sweetheart. Never change.

 

[El_Mussi]

It's not about winning/losing, it's about following evidence & logic ?

We all have to let go of things we think to move forward, if those things physically hold us back.

Do you have any practical advice based on any evidence or logic?

 

[MWJB]

Do you have any practical advice based on any evidence or logic?

Yes, you gave it to me here:

I'm absolutely stumped as thought that with the very finest setting that the grinder could offer I'd be able to force a time longer than 30s. But the longest I've had is 20.

A 20s shot might be OK at a very long ratio, like perhaps 1:6, but that seems a lot more espresso than you're aiming for. To extract normally at 1:2 (I think that's maybe a bit short but that's up to you) you need to grind finer.

 

[El_Mussi]

Yes, you gave it to me here:

A 20s shot might be OK at a very long ratio, like perhaps 1:6, but that seems a lot more espresso than you're aiming for. To extract normally at 1:2 (I think that's maybe a bit short but that's up to you) you need to grind finer.

I realise this - and also realised as stated above that my 2 day old machine will not grind finer even on the finest setting. Thanks though. I'll leave you to your forum

 

[MWJB]

I realise this - and also realised as stated above that my 2 day old machine will not grind finer even on the finest setting. Thanks though. I'll leave you to your forum

You came here looking for advice, you have it but you don't like it. Too bad.

Grow up, adjust your top burr, see if it helps.

 

[cuprajake]

Which basket are you using ? Is it a pressurised on no pressure one