[Coffee by the Casuals]

I'll counter that with why is it an excellent machine? And add that steaming via a thermo type approach is more likely to have problems than a boiler.

I don't see that being able to set all sorts and maybe even plot things on a display makes something an excellent machine.

Up to temperature in 3-4 minutes. Can schedule it to come on in the morning without additional paraphernalia. Small footprint. Easy to maintain. Steams milk excellently.

Oh, and it makes excellent coffee. At the press of a button I can switch between pressure and flow profiles if I find that a coffee isn't suited to my usual 6-bar extraction.

Since there are fewer than 100 of them in the wild in the UK (at last count), I'm assuming you've likely not tried one. There might be machines that are better suited to certain use cases, but it's undoubtedly an excellent machine. Not many have regretted the purchase.

With those observations in mind, are you now in a position to say why the Decent would be a no for you? Reading between the lines it just seems to be a case that the bells and whistles are unnecessary for you? That's a valid opinion to hold, but it doesn't necessary translate to others. It sounds like Dallah would jump at the chance if the price was right.

 

[Coffee by the Casuals]

@Coffee by the Casuals good price point? Compared to what? The cheapest option is £3500 landed in the UK. I've no doubt it's an excellent machine with superior capabilities but the longevity of a unit is questionable when the brains (the tablet) will be EOL in only a couple of years. Do Decent have a plan for the progression of tablet technology?

That why I said good, not excellent. I'm talking in terms of value, not absolute price. Take any other £3,500 machine and put it up against the Decent and I'll choose the Decent every time.

The brains of the machine aren't in the tablet, they're in the machine itself in the form of firmware. The tablet is a conduit for the software and updating the firmware. You can replace the tablet at any time. Some users have gone straight to a bigger, clearer screen, for example.

I don't know whether Decent have a plan for progression. I'm certain if you ask John on the Decent thread he would give you an answer. Personally I'm not at all worried about that.

 

[profesor_historia]

@Coffee by the Casuals good price point? Compared to what? The cheapest option is £3500 landed in the UK. I've no doubt it's an excellent machine with superior capabilities but the longevity of a unit is questionable when the brains (the tablet) will be EOL in only a couple of years. Do Decent have a plan for the progression of tablet technology?

I imagine by selling you a new and updated one.

 

[ajohn]

The Vesuvius comes in at a similar price - battle ship build. An SDB heats up in 3min. Probably a bit less when descaled actually. The Vesuvious has drain taps too but not sure how good they are. The Minima has unusual steaming capabilities and good temperature control. They probably haven't made the OPV easily accessible but could do.

I could do longer lower pressure brew on the DB. 2 ways. 2 different replumbs or make use of the hot water outlet control to do the same thing. The infusion settings can do similar things - as I am at the moment. Another point was made when I bought it @dfk41 more than enough things to play with - for a long time. There are loads and loads of different beans to try as well.

 

[DavecUK]

I am concerned about the MaraX ability to produce back to back milk drinks once we are able to have guests again. Our friends and family are very appreciative of my milk drinks. I suppose in steam priority mode, that might be addressed. I personally would like more control of the brew temp, only thing I really miss about by long gone SDB is the ability to quickly and easily adjust exact brew temp.

MaraX when used continually is as capable of back to back milk drinks as any HX with a 1.8l boiler. I suspect it won't be a limiting factor. My advice would be, wait until you have to start making those drinks and see how you get on....then make a decision.

 

[ajohn]

I actually said:MaraX when used continually is as capable of back to back milk drinks as any HX with a 1.8l boiler. I suspect it won't be a limiting factor. My advice would be, wait until you have to start making those drinks and see how you get on....then make a decision.

@Dallahsaid: I am concerned about the MaraX ability to produce back to back milk drinks once we are able to have guests again.

Does it pump water in when steaming? I'd have thought 1.8L would get around that problem though.

 

[DavecUK]

@ajohn I think you got me mixed up with Dallah...that's not what I said.

It works like any other HX, pumps water in when boiler needs refilling (e.g. water below autofill probe tip)

 

[Mrboots2u]

MaraX when used continually is as capable of back to back milk drinks as any HX with a 1.8l boiler. I suspect it won't be a limiting factor. My advice would be, wait until you have to start making those drinks and see how you get on....then make a decision.

What he said above

To @Dallahare you buying a new machine coz you just have money to burn or coz you genuinely unhappy with the machine and coffee you have at the moment.

I cant see it being limited in steam power with at sized boiler

 

[ajohn]

@ajohn I think you got me mixed up with Dallah...that's not what I said.

It works like any other HX, pumps water in when boiler needs refilling (e.g. water below autofill probe tip)

I was just think of what some machines do. As soon as steam is drawn pressure drops. Heating can't manage the heat loss and cold water going in. Something the SDB appears to handle well with a 0.6L steam boiler by not putting any in. As the OP has used one of those it may give him some idea of the capabilities of his current machine.

 

[DavecUK]

Hmmmm...whoosh, over the top springs to mind. i'll go and edit it for you..... ????

 

[ajohn]

To @Dallahare you buying a new machine coz you just have money to burn or coz you genuinely unhappy with the machine and coffee you have at the moment.

I see it as have money and want to spend it so looking for an excuse really. Hence suggesting the Minima which seems from a certain man's reviews to be a suitable direction to head in.

 

[Dallah]

I'm not unhappy with the coffee being produced but I just think it could be better. I am finding that I'm underwhelmed.by the steaming performance of the MaraX at times. Not all the time and so far not something I can reproduce reliably as I only have a couple of cappuccino in the morning before switching to espresso for the rest of the day. However once lockdown is eventually over and the family and friends come round the number of.milk based drinks will shoot up. I think IF steaming then becomes an issue I will just flip the switch to steam priority mode and jobs a good 'un.

I am thinking about the advice we give to newbies and that is to invest in grinder before the machine. Am I unhappy with the Mignon XL? Yes and no. It is a fantastic little on demand grinder which is built like a tank. That said, I am questioning my commitment to on demand workflow. I invest in high quality beans and having them languish in the hopper is not doing them justice. I could Heath Robinson the Mignon XL into a single doser but neither my other half not I would be happy with the look of that.

So I'm going to concentrate my thinking on possibly switching to a grinder designed from the ground up as a single doser. I'm considering either the Lagom or trying for the next drop of the NZ. Has anyone on this forum first hand experience of the Lagom? Hoffman seemed to be impressed with it.

 

[Dallah]

I see it as have money and want to spend it so looking for an excuse really. Hence suggesting the Minima which seems from a certain man's reviews to be a suitable direction to head in.

@ajohn How interesting that you can suss my motives without knowing me either online or in person. You haven't even bothered to read my posts in this thread (I've been clear the Minima was a non-starter) before judging my motives. But you go right ahead, make your assumptions and judge my motives.

 

[Like Medium Strong Coffee]

Although I am a newbie, I would only recommend that you choose your new machine carefully, which fits your requirements (current and any anticipated future demands), so that you won't regret your purchase and suffer from what-if thoughts. GL with your choice.

 

[HVL87]

@ajohn How interesting that you can suss my motives without knowing me either online or in person. You haven't even bothered to read my posts in this thread (I've been clear the Minima was a non-starter) before judging my motives. But you go right ahead, make your assumptions and judge my motives.

Can I ask why the Minima is a non-starter? Maybe looks or finish?

 

[KingoftheHeath]

I'm currently going down the Lagom-research worm hole. The link below is helpful (links to several threads within that single link). Pretty sure I'll be getting it either now or as a Christmas present to myself.
https://www.home-barista.com/grinders/lagom-p64-grinder-user-impressions-t67728.html

 

[profesor_historia]

I think that MaraX should be and it is able to steam enough for a couple or more of flat whites. Maybe it's not designed to pull 10 coffees in a row but I imagine you won't have people over so often either. If you want to cream more milk you can also do it as with the French press while MaraX is recovering between shots. My advice is to have crystal clear what exactly you want to upgrade, what you expect to achieve and which machine will give you that. Maybe a DB, as other colleagues said, Bianca could be a good option. To be honest I wouldn't upgrade just to be able to pull many shots in row for the occasions when I have guests, it doesn't seem a good enough reason. It's just my (subjective) point of view.

 

[Dallah]

Three reasons to discount the Minima for me. First the design just isn't for us. Especially having a MaraX now which I think is quite an elegant looking machine. That is very much down to personal taste and.others will disagree. Second, I have seen that some of the finish is a bit rough and ready. That might not be a fair judgement having never seen one in person but it's what I have seen in some posts. Lastly, I am forgetful and cack-handed. I have become very used to non-burn steam wands and wouldn't want to go back to non-insulated steam wands and all the minor burns that would entail. 😁

 

[Baffo]

@Dallah a Bianca is just as (if not more, due to the wood finish) elegant, is flexible with space (can either move tank to the side or have the machine plumbed in), has the better temperature control that you long for, and steam should be fine - I say should as I never had to make more than two drinks in a row. I won't suggest other machines that I haven't used myself, I can only say that I see no downside for the Bianca, according to your needs & wants.

Probably if you sold the MaraX and the Mignon XL you would make at least £1300, which added to the £2000 would make a grand total of £3300, which would be *just* about what you need for a Bianca (£1800) + Lagom (£1500 or so?). Coincidence?

 

[Mrboots2u]

WIill a Mara x not steam milk in a 500 ml jug so you can split for two drinks, the thing that will more than likely hold you back on any machine is the grinding and brewing not the milk steaming tbh